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View Poll Results: Tax The Churches?
No, they provide enough to the communities. 1 5.88%
No, that violates separation of church and state. 2 11.76%
Yes, but only new churches aka cults. 0 0%
Yes but only rich churches. Poor people pay enough. 3 17.65%
Tax them all and about freakin' time. 8 47.06%
I don't know, but it's an interesting idea. 1 5.88%
Other. 2 11.76%
Voters: 17. You may not vote on this poll

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  #31  
Old November 6th, 2010, 12:13 PM
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Default Re: Tax The Churches?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maturin View Post


Yes and no.

Spoiler: long honk
I believe in as broad a range of individual freedom as possible, and so I support the right of private gun ownership (also because of the 2nd Amendment and just the culture of a large portion of the country). I can't stand the thought of abortion, but I support the right of other individuals to make that decision (and I know that's hypocritical).

I also believe that society overall does better when it's reasonably stable, so I'm for as much state support as it takes to make sure people are fed, housed, educated, healed.

But I also think a carefully regulated capitalism is the best economic model. And I have no problem going to war to preserve the country -- but I no longer trust what anybody says about that.

And just about anything goes in one's private life, as long as no children or animals are involved and no one gets hurt.
Your feelings on abortion don't make you hypocritical, imo. I can be uncomfortable with something yet still reserve an individual's right to make thier own personal decision. That's not hypocritical, that's enlightened.
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  #32  
Old November 8th, 2017, 07:44 PM
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Default Re: Tax The Churches?

Im (necro-)bumping this thread because i've seen more than a few tweets about the issue lately, and i plan to link this thread to a tweet of my own in a few minutes, and it might be helpful to have this old thread back off of whatever backwater page it'd fallen too.
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Tax The Churches.

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  #33  
Old November 9th, 2017, 02:43 PM
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Default Re: Tax The Churches?

If churches are political actors, then yes, tax them.

They may need their own special tax code/bracket/whatever, as they are (supposedly) not for-profit business in the traditional sense. However, considering how many (expletive deleted) like Joel Osteen become billionaires on the back of their so-called churches, I really don't see why they are not taxed.
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  #34  
Old November 9th, 2017, 05:40 PM
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Default Re: Tax The Churches?

I'm not advocating anything resembling a flat tax at all.

I think they should be paying property taxes, declaring all incoming revenues, and people who work for the churches should be paying income taxes just like anybody else.

As for the property taxes, i think that churches should get breaks for providing valuable resources for their communities, for the churches that do those things. Run a food pantry out of your church - get a break on your property taxes for every needy person helped. Run AA meetings? Get a break for every meeting held each year. Employees getting out to help vulnerable individuals in the community? Give them a break on their payroll tax and give those employees a break on their income taxes. Running an after-school program for at-risk youth? Get a break on your property taxes for every kid there for each afternoon they're there. Et cetera! There have got to be thousands of great ways to incentivize churches and their members to become powerful forces of good in our communities, and the churches that are already doing so can reap rewards as some of the taxes from the churches that are being run as tax shelters can be diverted to the churches whose needs outstrip their current abilities.
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Tax The Churches.

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Last edited by Mr Mo; November 9th, 2017 at 05:42 PM.
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  #35  
Old November 10th, 2017, 11:40 AM
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Default Re: Tax The Churches?

I didn't mean to imply that you were suggesting a flat tax, I was just stating my own thoughts on the matter.

That said, I really like the idea of churches that actually help their communities in tangible ways receiving decent tax breaks, and those churches that exist primarily to enrich the few, wouldn't.

Pipe dream, but hey, we are not making policy here, only expressing opinions.
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  #36  
Old November 12th, 2017, 04:33 AM
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Default Re: Tax The Churches?

Quote:
Originally Posted by azteclady View Post
I didn't mean to imply that you were suggesting a flat tax, I was just stating my own thoughts on the matter.

That said, I really like the idea of churches that actually help their communities in tangible ways receiving decent tax breaks, and those churches that exist primarily to enrich the few, wouldn't.

Pipe dream, but hey, we are not making policy here, only expressing opinions.
Sadly, you're almost certainly right about this discussion being a pipe dream. I'm also saddened by my impression that folks at twitter are happy to put together 280 character tweets about taxing churches when that format makes it perfect for shock value, but not one has come over here to actually expand on the idea and talk about potential policy and implementation.

I really believe that this idea could benefit our societies in incredibly diverse ways.

I didn't think you were advocating a flat tax, i just wanted to make it plain that *i* wasn't doing so.

And for the record i'm not necessarily talking about complete abolishment of letting communities use their churches as tax shelters, but i think they should be willing to fork over a chunk of it at least. The margins in that are so fat right now that we could easily skim a minimum of 25-35% and still leave the process highly profitable.

Just try to imagine how much good that money could do in food banks, outreach programs, afterschool programs, etc. How many lives could be saved directly through condom and syringe distribution; testing for HIV, TB, Hepatitis, and others. How many lives could be diverted from ever needing those services 20 and 30 years from now? What improvements could be made in the quality of lives of seniors who need help, both permanently and temporarily? I know you personally aren't a fan of gertie, but imagine what good could be done for her mental health right now if she had somebody to stop by and bring her lunch, and sit and eat it with her, just twice a week? To help her carry her groceries up the stairs instead of her having to stand out in the parking lot waiting for some kind stranger to magically appear? The benefits to her mental health would be immense, and those benefits would affect every other aspect of her life.

Lots of churches in the cities offer these services, but they can do only so much because they operate in economically destitute areas and resources are virtually non-existent. I see taxing the churches as, among MANY othre potential benefits, an opportunity to redistribute those resources to where they're needed. And it shouldn't be seen as a redistribution of wealth, not that i'm against the concept in general, but specifically because donations to churches are considered under US tax code to be CHARITABLE DONATIONS.

Lawd i could go on and on all day about this subject and i hope i remember to post more in the future. I hope others join in. I strongly believe that this is a conversation that can improve our society immeasurably. AZ, thank you so much for your contributions already, and i'm always interested in anything further you may have to add.
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Tax The Churches.

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